Age Is a Bullshit Excuse

I'm sure I've covered this before, but screw it... I'm going to cover it again. Using your age as an excuse for being incapable of something is bullshit. Unless you're coding at the age of 3, I don't want to hear it. I cannot repeat enough: children today have access to the Internet at a far earlier age than we did 5-10 years ago. If 9 year olds — and yes, I've seen it with my own two eyes — can code semantically correct syntax after having used the Internet for little more than 6 months, then there is no reason why someone who's been doing it for a few years can't have developed a similar grasp.

IF YOU HAVEN'T GRASPED THE BASICS, YOU SHOULDN'T BE WRITING TUTORIALS.

I'm hoping the caps will emphasise the seriousness of that point. I don't care how shit your personal website is... they are after all there for experimentation and fun. Cover it in Britney Spears and your appalling grammar for all I care. However, the second you enter the realm of labelling yourself a web designer/developer and start charging people for your "services", you are entering my world. There isn't a morally superior, "I'm on my high horse" visitor to my site — loyally regular or otherwise — that is going to tell me I am not entitled to criticise people who think they're capable of playing with the big boys.

If we cannot accept that there are things we do not know, then we will never advance or improve (personally, or professionally). Shit, I wish I had more people to bounce my code off and to tell me where I'm going wrong, because I get stuck in a rut and find it incredibly frustrating.

Anyway, that rant wasn't the purpose of this entry. Indeed, it seems to have overwhelmed it somewhat (I do get carried away sometimes). In fact, I wanted to highlight exactly why being 13 is a poor excuse by showing you some great websites by people who are exactly that... 13 (or thereabouts).

"last full show"

This is Ellie's site. She's not updated in over a year, but she was 13 when she created the site. The layout is simple, attractive, and she's successfully implemented it as a WordPress theme. Her blog entries are well written (grammatically) and I didn't see the word "MySpace" anywhere, which made my evening.

Auberginer.org

Lisa's site is not particularly superbly coded, but it's cute, it works in Firefox and a quick glance seems to show that everything is spelt correctly and appropriately punctuated. "Could've" instead of "could of" made me a happy bunny. (You have no idea how quickly "could of" and "should of" annoys me.) Lisa is also 13, according to her "Facts" page.

"bat ears"

Justine was 12 years old when she created this site (another that has not been updated since last year, unfortunately). Her website is cute, and although the coding is not up to my standards by any stretch of the imagination, her spelling and grammar are again perfectly adequate. Her text is a good size and her artwork surpasses my shitty attempts at pixeling.

sodevious.net

Nicole is 14. I don't think I need to tell you what's done well on her site, it's pretty obvious if you ask me. Nicole was featured in the New York Times in February this year.

So yes, you can sit there and tell me that 12/13/14 year old girls should be given a free ride, but when you've got children and teens demonstrating skills that I didn't pick up until I was 17 or 18 (yes, I had people tell me I was shit too) I'm not going to care enough to listen. Spend less time bitching about how unfair and unjust life is because someone doesn't like your site, and you might actually get somewhere... no?

Comments (80)

On Wed 13th Aug 2008 @ 20:13, Sarah said:

Age is certainly not an excuse, as the sites you have showcased prove.
On Wed 13th Aug 2008 @ 20:18, Chantal said:

Age ain't nothing but a number ;-)
On Wed 13th Aug 2008 @ 20:48, Amber said:

I'm kind of jealous of that last example.
On Wed 13th Aug 2008 @ 20:50, Rhys said:

Age is really a benefit.

I'm 24, and it's taken me forever to learn to drive, because of my age. It's taken me a lot longeer to get where I am now than a 17 year old. So I suspect a 9 year old, given the right tuition and a open mind, could learn abstract functions such as PHP a lot faster than a 18 year old.

My 2p's worth
On Wed 13th Aug 2008 @ 20:52, Vera said:

*fervent nod* Although I'm sure someone will tell you that you decided to hac pick every single genius 13-year-old online XP

The last example though: it's gorgeous!
On Wed 13th Aug 2008 @ 20:57, Joe said:

"So yes, you can sit there and tell me that 12/13/14 year old girls should be given a free ride"
And boys
I am 13, and I, freakish as it sounds, love coding. I refuse to open a website if its not looking good, with valid XHTML and CSS. And I often do come across the 13 year olds with flashing backgrounds, pixel fonts and myspace shit, but refuse to affiliate myself with such idiocy. I often find the 'cliques' I am involved in tend to be people a lot older than myself. I also pride myself on my grammar (Now I said that, im sure this comment will be full of silly little mistakes). Anyway, Before I write an essay on my thoughts I will stop there : )
On Wed 13th Aug 2008 @ 21:03, Clem said:

I'm 14, and I agree completely. While my coding is valid, I've done my best and I use semantically correct tags. I've been told plenty of times by teachers that I have above-average spelling and grammar, and I've basically got the hang of Wordpress. Whenever I hear somebody say, "Oh, she's only 13, that's okay," it makes me mad. No, my website is by no means perfect, but the fact that I'm 14 doesn't mean I have the right to have a terrible site.
On Wed 13th Aug 2008 @ 21:08, Emma said:

I completely agree with this article. I'm 14 myself and still learning about website making, but would never use my age as an excuse for making a crap site
Those examples are amazing btw
On Wed 13th Aug 2008 @ 21:09, Vanesa said:

Hey! You forgot to include me!

Just joking. Those are really nice sites. I wish they were active, though.
On Wed 13th Aug 2008 @ 21:18, Catherine said:

Like most others, I agree. Age is only a number, it all depends on people themselves. Anyone can learn html and CSS thesedays, I mean it's not that hard with so many resources on the internet.

I would like to call myself an example, but unfortunatly when I first came on the internet when I was 13 I was very immature, my spelling was bad (and I refused to do anything about it) and my designs weren't that good neither. It's taken my three years to get where I am, and even then I wouldn't dare try sell a design or pass off as a proffesional.

I liked the first and last designs you showed!!
On Wed 13th Aug 2008 @ 21:22, Jenny said:

Hear fucking hear.
On Wed 13th Aug 2008 @ 21:28, Akash said:

I agree. Even though I sucked at age 13. I think I got better in the past few years

I am 16, but I am still contemplating if I should open up my services. I know people SHOULDN'T judge me because of my age, or my lack of web design education/degree, but I am worried they will... Nevertheless, those examples you displayed are truly remarkable.
On Wed 13th Aug 2008 @ 21:43, Nicole said:

Wow, thanks for that!
On Wed 13th Aug 2008 @ 23:16, Arwen said:

I was 13/14 when I made my first website. It was a shitty geocities page, but I was building my own HTML pages on my own domain by the time I was 15. They were still shitty, but I like to think I've improved since then. I am not a child prodigy. Age is not an excuse.
On Wed 13th Aug 2008 @ 23:45, Bubs said:

Aww, OMC members!! *feels proud*
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 00:40, Hadeel said:

I hate when the young people use that age as an excuse for shitty coding. I am 14 and am trying my hardest to keep my site XHTML 1.0 Transitional, so anyone can do it!
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 00:44, Hadeel said:

Agh, what the hell, I'm almost 16. What have I been drinking?
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 00:49, Angela said:

Couldn't have said it better myself. Hiding behind age is a bullshit excuse.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 01:54, Mat said:

Not bad, not bad. When you claim to be a pro and charge people money for your work that's what irks me as you outlined...After all I work in this field full-time and I wouldn't push shit like that out of the door without being highly disappointed in myself yet these people think they are somehow ok to do so because they are younger.. pish posh.

You wanna play in the big boys sandpit, best start acting like one.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 02:18, Hannah said:

Took me until 15- almost 16- to realize I wasn't doing things right. o_o
But you're absolutely right: age is no excuse!
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 02:27, April said:

You are exactly right - all the tweens (I have only just graduated from teenybopper rank) that have celebrity, weborexic layouts and call themselves designers are just bullshitting themselves. And the thing that sucks is, they have their head so far up their ass that they don't want to listen to people telling them that is not the way to do things!
Last year is when I actually decided I wasn't doing it right - I've been a fan of your site for years Jem and only recently have I decided to join the blogging world haha - and decided to get help for myself.
The vast majority of tween sites out there is just appalling and when you see 25 year old women (take our Karmen, for example) doing exactly the same thing - you just wonder what happened.

I'm over my rant lol.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 02:30, April said:

^ Oh, and to add - tweens shouldn't be allowed to have excuses made for them! They say they're professional web designers - they should get hit with what Jem Web designers get hit with!
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 02:37, Nicole said:

Damn I'm thoroughly depressed now. Especially the last site. Well, this just makes me want to better myself! Thank yous. And you make a great point (blah blah everyone has said that already), especially about the grammar. zomgsrsly.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 02:54, Kris said:

Jem, redesign your website. I would like to see a new layout
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 03:13, Scott said:

I don't think age is an excuse, but obviously someone aged 12 isn't going to be as good at spelling as someone of 20. So really it does matter a little.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 03:37, Amanda said:

I'm just jealous that these people have internet access at such a young age. Heck, I'm 21 and I didn't have internet access until I was 15, and that was only sporadic at best! I didn't even get broadband internet (instead of dialup) until I was 19!
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 03:47, Stephanie said:

After learning HTML and coding it poorly for a little while, once I discovered web standards, it really only took me a couple of days to switch modes and do it correctly, since I already understood the concept of HTML, CSS and design. There is no excuse.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 05:39, Robbie said:

Age isn't an excuse, but these girls put in a lot of effort and time to learn things correctly. As for me, I took the beginning web design class at my uni last semester, and the teacher went so far as to say that deprecated code is OK because everyone uses it and since everyone uses it it will never be taken out. I wanted to slam my head into the desk.

I, personally, still can't code as well as those girls, but I also don't claim to. There's a HUGE difference between coding your own site shittily and putting out shit tutorials.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 06:25, Polly said:

What an interesting post. Amused me a lot and I do agree, though most times I don't see people bitching about how awful their site is compared to a 13 year old's.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 07:47, Mumblies said:

I'm old and grey - take pity on me lol.
Only kidding, I am a firm believer in the old adage of "You are never too old to learn"
I don't recall ever telling you that you were 'shit' Jem. In fact, the way I remember it was I tried to encourage you every step of the way.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 08:35, Eunice said:

The last example is honestly amazing, since she started just a year ago O_O
And I make excuses for myself. It's really very sad.
I say I should stop being lazy.
And awesome post, by the way =)
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 08:37, Yvette said:

I was 14 when I started to design websites. And my designs are crappy and people would just... not use it.

Oops, I guess the owner of Connito.net is also 13.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 10:47, nerd. said:

This really pisses me off.

All those kids are a gazillion times better at graphic design than me!!

I'm going to go slit my feckin' wrists now.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 10:51, Regina said:

Agreed. I am 13 years old and I don't think age is an excuse. I type in proper English on my websites. I have to admit something though-- my coding isn't perfect.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 10:52, Nelchee said:

excellent examples I started out when I was about 16, but it was only 2 years later that I learned what web standards are and how to apply them properly... good job, girls!
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 11:04, Niki said:

I started out a year ago when I was 13 years old. I think I've done well so far

*ish proud of those girls*
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 11:51, Baohan said:

You've just make me try harder. I'm already 13 and I suck.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 13:02, Ilona said:

I started when I was 12-ish. You know, it's not rare to see my dad asking me about web or internet-related stuff. ;d
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 14:14, Louise said:

Well said and well presented Jem! Those examples are truly wonderful of what's achievable with a bit of your own effort.

Age really doesn't matter when it comes to maturity. You can be 10 and be a pure, polite gentleman or lady... or you can be 30 and exhibit obnoxious behaviour usually associated with hyperactive kids.

Not only websites, but it's wonderful seeing 12-13s doing their own illustration and photography! (No "credit: anonymous Google Images" bullshit.) They actually try and achieve!
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 17:02, Chelsea said:

Wow. I started on Piczo when I was 11, and now being 15 I think I've came on a good bit! I may not be a l33t PHP ninja like yourself, but I'm happy with how far I've came!

Nice examples by the by
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 17:53, Nat Marie said:

I started very late in comparison to the girls showcased. I didn't start blogging fully until I was in college (18), but I started designing small things before then (15-16). I will admit that I sucked then, and I'm still not that good now at 23, but at least I can boast almost impeccable grammar and spelling. I'm damn near obsessive about it actually. I'm also improving on the web end as well.

But seriously--I was reading some of these sites by 13-year-olds who think they should get a free ride from proper spelling and the like, and my 8-year-old niece--a 3rd grader this year--can spell better than these 13-year-olds (or heaven forbid, the 25-year-old!). That's no excuse. If you can't spell a word, or if you're unsure about the spelling of one, get a dictionary or spell checker. I'm sure you were taught how to use those tools, right?!
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 19:22, Kristina said:

I agree with you.
I can code perfectly validly, and I'm thirteen.
I've seen plenty of fifteen year olds telling me that their sites are amazing and wonderful and fabulous for their age but really... they're not.
I still have a problem with people saying that thirteen year olds are capable of nothing but texting and talking about boys.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 19:23, Vera said:

I'm thinking that someone is confusing 13 year-old with 3 year-old... the 1 at the beginning does make a slight difference.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 19:34, Jabed said:

okay can soemone please tell me what is so extra special about the last website, dont get me wrong it looks nice but ive seen better from people at young ages.

but i must say, Jem, its nice that you praise a few websites in a blogpost rather than expose websites that need help when you could have simply contacted them and told them privately your thoughts on there website.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 19:36, Jabed said:

*sorry for my really bad spelling on the previous post =[
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 19:41, Jem said:

I fail to see what purpose would be served e-mailing someone privately. Not only would the recipient STILL throw a temper tantrum because I dared criticise their precious site, but other people would not get the benefit of my wisdom.

I've used the same methods for the past 8 years, I'm not about to change now...
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 19:47, Gem said:

I'm entirely in agreement. Anyone can create a good website, it's just a case of having the patience and being willing to learn.

Having said that, it's also a case of stumbling across the right influence/inspiration. I started coding around age 11 and soon enough I discovered iframes (because they were clearly "useful" and "cool") and I thought I'd found the path to enlightenment. I was part of a community who seemed generally unaware standards existed and so I can see where it passes some people by. I think the problem arises when a person isn't mature enough to accept that they might not be flying quite as high as they thought they were and I think you get people like that of all ages. I think people should be treated based on the maturity they show, not on the number that's attached to them.

On use of the English language, I think there must be some general break down in education. No, I don't always spell correctly (thank goodness for FF's spell-checker) and my grammar can waver, but at least I try. In fact, I'm still the lame person who insists on attempting to painstakingly type out the whole, full, correctly-spelt word in text messages . This might explain why I rarely text...
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 19:50, Jem said:

Wahey! Someone else who writes out full words in texts - you've made my day
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 19:54, Barbilee said:

i dontuses my age at all b/c i cant spell..... and yes i need help with my stuff and yes i am learning but yah i mite not take crission right but i learned to deal with it. but yah ....
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 20:59, Shelbie said:

I'm gonna say I have to disagree. Some people just aren't good spellers and have trouble remembering grammar, I just don't understand what that has to do with owning a website? I'm sure a site can have a few errors, it wouldn't be the end of the world. I, myself have not got the strongest language skills and I'm still learning. So people who are younger may not as well have the skills of a 20-year-old.

Likewise with coding. I believe I started a site so I could work with graphic design and basically put it to use. I never planned or never do plan to be the greatest coder because that is something I'm just not interested in hugely. So why be criticised so heavily for it? Yeah, age isn't a good excuse but sometimes learning ability are effected by your age. So I don't see the huge, um, 'bitch' over it.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 21:41, Jenny said:

I don�t think age is an excuse, but obviously someone aged 12 isn�t going to be as good at spelling as someone of 20. So really it does matter a little.

Scott, not really. There's obviously a majority/minority, but from what I keep seeing in my little shell (which only gets knocked about by Jem/Snark :x), there are twenty year olds who spell atrociously, and some twelve year olds who have relatively good spelling.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 22:06, Jem said:

@Shelbie: if you can't spell, you use a spell-checker. If you can't code, you don't write tutorials. It's that simple.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 22:19, Scott said:

@Jenny: I didn't say 20 year olds were perfect, did I? I was simply trying to put my point across that not 12 year olds are not as experienced. Okay, maybe I should've put that better in my other comment.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 23:14, Jem said:

@Scott: while it is inevitable that you learn more as you get older, it doesn't take a genius to figure out how a spelling checker works.
On Thu 14th Aug 2008 @ 23:37, Jabed said:

"I�ve used the same methods for the past 8 years, I�m not about to change now�"

I understand but sometimes it's nice to try different methods, just like it's nice for people to code/design better and not throw temper tantrums after having their website critisized by saying 'I've done my website like this for two months, I'm not going to change and see if it has any postive effects"

"@Shelbie: if you can�t spell, you use a spell-checker. If you can�t code, you don�t write tutorials. It�s that simple."

I disagree, if I hadn't stumbled across a few crap tutorials that I've used, I wouldn't have even started webdesignign and eeventaully findng better tutorials and better ways of doing things. Sometimes people also write tutorials in a certain way for a certain target audience, lets say an audience is celeb obsessed teenagers who likes making blends and don't care if websites have invalid coding and they just want a few 'copy and paste' tutorials - they would be meeting the criteria of that audience by writing lame tutorials. Sure the audience needs to see the bigger picture but they wil leventually, I'm sure.
This is a crap example, but if a great author wrote a short story for 5 years olds and used the word 'and' all the time in his sentences, it would be understanding as he is aiming for younger kids who may read and speak like that.
I understand that 13 year olds should know that coding is important and shouldn't give out bad tutorials but they are helping there fellow people and in turn will develop and learn from mistakes.
On Fri 15th Aug 2008 @ 00:02, Scott said:

@Jem: Okay, I agree spell checkers are everywhere... even on WordPress, but as someone told me yesterday when I mentioned spell checkers; if you have really bad spelling then it doesn't always recognise the word.
On Fri 15th Aug 2008 @ 00:17, Shelbie said:

Can I just say. Actually, yeah I can.

If you are so bothered about spelling errors and punctuation on websites, why don't you help individuals and teach them of what you know instead of giving them a "pants" award or saying that their sites suck. Everyone has potential and everyone can still grow - even you - so do the sensible thing and help them instead of bitching at them.

Or better yet become an English teacher...
On Fri 15th Aug 2008 @ 00:30, Lauren said:

"Some people just aren�t good spellers and have trouble remembering grammar, I just don�t understand what that has to do with owning a website?"

It has a lot to do with owning a website, because if someone can't understand what you've written they're not going to bother staying on your site. I'm dyslexic, but use a spelling and grammar checker, and I'm pretty sure at least 99% of my website is spelt correctly. If someone like me with an legitimate reason for bad grammar and spelling can use a spell checker others can too.
I too write in full English in texts. My friends never reply to me, because they say my texts are too difficult to read, yet it takes me hours to work out what on earth they've written.
I bet now I've said that this my comment is littered with errors. Please excuse any, I'm dividing my attention between this and A Bit of Fry and Laurie.
On Fri 15th Aug 2008 @ 02:10, Vitalis said:

@Jabed: What's the point in using a different method when there's nothing wrong with the first one? If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

@Shelbie: Jem's Pants Awards *do* point out an individual's mistakes. The only people who can't see that are people who take criticism just a little bit too seriously.
On Fri 15th Aug 2008 @ 02:16, Shelbie said:

@Vitalis: (Oops, my spell checker says it's incorrect, does that mean I'm spelling it wrong?) It's also a sad mockery of someone's hobby.

Which evidently isn't funny.
On Fri 15th Aug 2008 @ 02:19, Mira said:

Oh, but it's not really about being "too young to code". It's being young to take criticism. When they say "I'm 13, cut me some slack!", they're actually scared and confused. They are mama's little girls (boys) and people tend to treat them as kids. Sure, they hate that behaviour, but many of them are not ready to being treated as adults. Meaning: in the "real" world, if you create something and publish it for others to see, you will be criticized. When you create a site people will see it; chances are that your visitors won't act like your caring aunt who just won't tell you the truth because you are a kid and she doesn't want to hurt your feelings. So, when somebody says that your site is ugly, bad coded or choking on bad spelling, you will cry: "I'm only 13!", but that doesn't mean: "I'm too young to code", but "I'm not used to be treated like this".
Kids just need to grow up. The sooner the better.
On Fri 15th Aug 2008 @ 03:51, Kristin said:

Wow! Those kinda are pretty talented! I wish I was that much of a prodigy! I don't think I'll ever be a pro coder, but I do my best. And I agree, age is nothing but a number (for the most part).
On Fri 15th Aug 2008 @ 03:53, Kristin said:

^ damn my spelling mistakes! My microwave was beeping and I was rushing. >.< I could have just waiting 5 seconds but noooo. Sorry about that!
On Fri 15th Aug 2008 @ 04:44, Chien Yee said:

I can admit that I was never a good designer until late last year. Previously, all my designs look like shit, and I don't really like them compared to the ones I put for my site since QYnet existed. I guess it improves every time since I like to experiment.

I was 13 before and my code was valid. I remember the days when I always play with the validators and learning to make it "Valid something". Those days were fun I just remember converting premade layouts' iframes to divs. My sister called me crazy for that

As for spelling, well, I am learning English as a second language and I don't find any problem with it. I might have typos, but once I spot them, I'd edit it. I guess learning a language is a skill, and to have English as your mother tongue and a person not knowing it is a big shame, don't you agree?

I forced myself to learn Chinese when I was in Grade 3 because I realized that I was 8 years old and didn't understand a word of my mother tongue, and that's a big disgrace. Now I'm quite fluent, but still not as perfect as others, but at least I try to improve. I quit because I didn't have the time anymore.
On Fri 15th Aug 2008 @ 05:27, Hazel said:

Good design knows no boundaries! I think it really depends on how much practice you get in making websites that makes your layout beautiful. The more you spend time practicing and writing code, the more beautiful your layout will be.
On Fri 15th Aug 2008 @ 09:04, Jem said:

if I hadn�t stumbled across a few crap tutorials that I�ve used, I wouldn�t have even started webdesignign and eeventaully findng better tutorials and better ways of doing things.

And if you hadn't wasted time on the crap tutorials, you would have got straight to the better way of doing things and would be a higher level - have a greater knowledge - than you do now. (I'm using 'you' in the general sense, not necessarily you specifically.)

but if a great author wrote a short story for 5 years olds and used the word �and� all the time in his sentences

...then they're not a great author. A great author can tailor his or her writing without sounding like a retard.

This isn't about using too many "and"s or making a few typos (hell, I make craploads of typos, that is what my typo form is for), it's about constant and consistent mistakes when even 8 year olds should know better.

why don�t you help individuals and teach them of what you know

http://www.jemjabella.co.uk/articles
http://www.jemjabella.co.uk/beginners-guide-to-php-part-one
http://www.jemjabella.co.uk/beginners-guide-to-php-part-two
http://www.jemjabella.co.uk/beginners-guide-to-php-part-three
http://www.jemjabella.co.uk/beginners-guide-to-php-part-four
http://www.jemjabella.co.uk/scripts
http://www.tutorialtastic.co.uk/
http://tinyurl.com/codegrrlposts
...is that enough, or do you suggest I spend even more of what little free time I have "helping" people who really can't be arsed to learn?

It�s also a sad mockery of someone�s hobby.

Which evidently isn�t funny.

You're in a small minority.
On Fri 15th Aug 2008 @ 12:07, Jenny said:

@Jenny: I didn�t say 20 year olds were perfect, did I? I was simply trying to put my point across that not 12 year olds are not as experienced. Okay, maybe I should�ve put that better in my other comment.

I didn't say 20 year olds weren't perfect.

And yeah, you should have put that better in your other comment.
On Fri 15th Aug 2008 @ 14:24, Georgina said:

Their websites are simply amazing and I have stumbled across them before. Their skill is wonderful, and truly, age doesn't matter. Everyone has the capacity for things. And as an extra note, grammar and spelling mistakes drive me bloody INSANE. The 'could of' thing that people do, the 'your' and 'your're' getting mixed up (that is my most hated), or even the 'its' and 'it's'.
On Sat 16th Aug 2008 @ 06:05, Brian said:

I completely agree with this entry completely, but I disagree with one minor thing you said. "[...]sit there and tell me that 12/13/14 year old girls should be..." Why did you just say "girls"? Don't you find that a tiny bit stereotypical?
On Sat 16th Aug 2008 @ 14:43, Chans said:

Even though I try to make my code and CSS valid all the time, sometimes minor changes break the code for me and I have to start again and learn how to fix those errors. I'm not ashamed to say I'm not a perfect coder but at least I try to and when I can't figure it out on my own I try to find the good tutorials out there (a lot of which I have you to thank for Jem) and try to improve my skills that way.

It doesn't matter how old you are, you can either be good or bad at something you want to do and if you're bad at it there are ALWAYS ways to make you better. You just need to put time and effort in and that's half the work.
On Sat 16th Aug 2008 @ 19:20, Mari said:

I ageee with you completely. In fact, I once posted about the same thing. SInce I am thirteen, it bothers me so much when others with awful sites get free rides and excuses just because of their age. My site is far from perfect, but I do use WordPress and XHTML and my coding is usually valid, except for when I neglect it for a long time. (Like right now it's a mess). I started when I was 11 and I've had some of the most terrible layouts and coding, but with every layout I get a little bit better.
I am disappointed with a few of your examples. I know you could have found more sites by people in the 12-14 range that did have coding more up to your standards. Two of the sites you picked seem to use i-frames. I know lots of 14 year olds (maybe not as many 12 or 13 year olds) who have well-coded sites as well as good spelling and grammar, and I think some of them would have been better examples than auberginer.org and "bat ears".
On Mon 18th Aug 2008 @ 04:02, Ilona said:

English isn't my mother tongue either but I have to say that I'm pretty good. Sure I still make mistakes on my grammar and perhaps punctuations, but 95% of my spelling is correct. What I can't stand is when people type with caps and multiple 'Z's instead of 'S's. And I'm incredibly irritated when people who have English as their mother tongue -I assume they mostly do- can't differentiate between:
- it's and its
- they're, their and there
- your and you're
- should of and should have, could of and could have

;d
On Mon 18th Aug 2008 @ 09:56, Jem said:

Why did you just say �girls�? Don�t you find that a tiny bit stereotypical?

...because the entry was about girls, and a girl who's age is being chucked around as an excuse. If I'd featured a website made by a guy, I've have said girls/boys.

I am disappointed with a few of your examples. I know you could have found more sites by people in the 12-14 range that did have coding more up to your standards.

I tried to feature people with different talents. Auberginer and Bat Ears were picked for their graphical skills
On Mon 18th Aug 2008 @ 16:36, Vera said:

Ilona: AMEN!
On Mon 18th Aug 2008 @ 18:40, ben said:

Ilona- Within your post, there were several errors in punctuation and grammar. The post lacked multiple commas necessary for understanding your point. You claim that you can wield the language well, but your grammar and punctuation says otherwise. What I cannot stand are self-assured fools claiming to be better than English-speakers at our own language. You are not worth my energy, so I will conclude this diatribe. (This message is coming from a child thirteen years of age.)
On Mon 18th Aug 2008 @ 18:42, ben said:

In a rather hypocritical note, t hat last message contained various errors. Ilona won't be able to find them.
On Thu 21st Aug 2008 @ 02:35, Nick said:

Woo! I'm 17 and it's nice to see older (not in an insulting way, of couse) people standing up for the younger ones! I hate people who think because you're only 17 your code and design sucks.
On Fri 22nd Aug 2008 @ 04:19, Vera said:

"You are not worth my energy" -- I LOVE it when you say this. If you ruly didn't care, you wouldn't have bothered... at all.
Thirteen-year-old and already owning Google? Tsk tsk, aren't you a child-prodigy?
On Fri 22nd Aug 2008 @ 07:15, Kieu said:

Wow, Ben. Way to sound like a real jerk. If you read Ilona's post at all she claimed that her spelling was 95% correct and that she was prone to making some grammatical errors. I find that Ilona's English is really good considering that it is her second language. Also, before you are so quick to criticise other people, learn to capitalize your own name.
On Sun 24th Aug 2008 @ 03:05, Nick said:

Also, before you are so quick to criticise other people, learn to capitalize your own name.

Hehe, pwnd.

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